LOSTCasts 24: Dave

This latest podcast focuses on season 2, episode 19 of LOST, entitled "Dave." In this podcast, we discuss Hurley and his backstory at length, including speculation about Libby's motivations, as well as her mental condition. We also talk about what Eko might be building, and the discussion surrounding Henry Gale's continued interrogation, and his conversation with Locke. As usual, we end things this week with LOST links, spoilers and talk about what's in store on next week's episode of LOST. We end with exit music from a great band, and one of Matthew Fox's favorites, The Black Angels.

Download podcast #24 here

Here are some links related to the podcast:
Transcript of season 2, episode 19, Dave
General reactions thread on The Fuselage
Picture of "Widmore Labs" on Henry's balloon
Discussion about Dave on The Fuselage
Thread on ABC forums about photo inconsistency
Original Hurley/Dave
Photo of Hurley/Dave
Is Libby lying to Hurley? Thread on The Fuselage
Kaizer Soze/Wizard of Oz theory

LOST links:
KFC commercial parody of LOST
"Skinner Box" movie on IMDB
Homepage of The Black Angels
Pre-order The Black Angels' new album

Comments

[Timmy]

Yay new cast, listening now. ^_^

[Aaron]

The E! online spoiler where locke and charlie get killed by henry gale was said on april fools day, it was a joke!!!!! I would think you guys would know that

[crapjohnson]

I noticed the look Libby gave as they were walking away from the cliff too, and after reading posts about it and having time to think about it, I think a good explanation is that she was just giving the usual odd look every character gives when they are about to go into flashback mode (since that had to be her flashback at the end and not Hurley's).

[crapjohnson]

And something I forgot to add to my above comment was that I think that Hurley's question about if he could change is what brought on that look and flashback from her, making her think, "yes you can change, after all, I changed". That sort of comes from my idea that Libby is not evil or a mole or any of these other things people say, but that she changed and got her life together after she got out of the mental hospital. The reason she lied to Hurley about knowing her from somewhere and not telling him she was in the same mental hospital is that she doesn't want him to think she's crazy, but she is a normal person, because she likes him and doesn't want to mess it up.

[Collette]

I like this group. I'll have to pick up the album. Good cast. I find myself completely agreeing with you guys regarding Locke. I used to like him but now I just feel sorry for him. The thing with him and Henry is going to end very badly.

[Katerina]

Love the podcasts guys, but I really don't want to hear spoilers. Is there any way that when you have a new episode in the episode description you write the time range when you are speaking about spoilers...an exact kind of thing...how can I know if the spoilers are over without listening to them?

[Jenni Lou]

A few kinda silly comments:

1.That peanut butter container would totally bust. I've worked in a number of restaurants and they all use the same packaging for dressings and such and those plastic containers aren't very durable. In fact, I have dropped them before and they just splatter everywhere! So it's completely plausible it would burst. :P

2. Maybe Libby is a natural blonde and her hair was dyed brown around the time she was in the institution. That certainly would explain her roots, no? :)

3. You made a little list about the coincidence of having all these people in the institution, Santa Rosa. Hurley, Libby and Lenny were all there...but don't forget that Locke's mother was also there as well. So maybe this place has a larger role in the events of the island after all.

4. The EOnline spoilers from Kristin were made on April Fool's Day, guys. She even made a disclaimer after her she made those comments saying that they were not true. Just an FYI.

[Weesh]

Guys go back and look @ that E!Online article - it was an april fools joke ~ towards the bottom after it mentions additional shows it spells it out....

[Blinder]

We got an email that refered to the eonline article and noone emailed us that it was an april fools joke and none of us read tha tinfo anywhere. But it ws pretty clear in the cast that we all pretty much doubted its validity.

[Blinder]

And the reason I dodn't read to the bottom of the page on the eonline article is because the Gray's Anatomy spoiler was right after the Lost spoiler. And I really don't care about Gray's anatomy so I stopped reading.

[NShah85]

Hey guys. I love the podcast. I was watching Season 1: Solitary, and I just noticed that the phrase "see you in the next life" wasn't originally coined by Desmond. Rather, Sayid said it to Danielle when he was telling her what Nadia wrote on the back of the picture. I'm not sure if anyone already said that, if so, I'm sorry for repeating it. I was just watching it when I caught the phrase. Well, keep up the great work. stay lost.

[Emily]

even though that was a april fools spoiler there has been talk through out the season that 2 main people are going to die. first was shannon. i think the other person to die will be walt. it make sence that he should be the one to die since you can't keep the kid from aging.

[Doubing T]

Just discovered these casts, and are very enjoyable, since here in the Netherlands, not many are following the show as I do. What was thinking is that the "swan-hatch" of the losties is being monitored by other hatches. And although i think camera's are improbable, listening devices could easily be installed. It would explain the fears of "henry gail" because he is still aware of being listened to. And he is holding on to his story although he's being tortured, because he knows, if the "others" hear he blown his cover, he would be practibly also dead. If he claims to be as afraid of the "evil" leader. He would find this captivity by the losties, as the one and only oppertunity to run free, but he is still loyal to his "evil" leader. That's why i think, they are monitored.

[Aaron]

A note on the melodramatic "God can't see us here" line:

Remember back in "Maternity Leave", when Locke (?) gave Henry Gale "The Brothers Karamazov" to read? I thought something about that line in Wednesday's show sounded familiar, so I looked back into the book, and found this section. It's from the famous "Grand Inquisitor" chapter, and is spoken by Ivan to Alyosha:

"... There is, for example, one little monestary poem (from the Greek, of course): 'The Mother of God visits the Torments', with scenes of a boldness not inferior to Dante's. The Mother of God visits hell and the Archangel Michael guides her through 'the torments'. She sees sinners and their sufferings. Among them, by the way, she sees a most amusing class of sinners in a burning lake: some of them sink so far down into the lake that they can no longer come up again, and 'these God forgets'-- an expression of extraordinary depth and force. ... [p. 247, translation by Richard Pevear and Larissa Volokhonsky, Vintage Press, 1991]

I doubt that Gale's line was a direct reference to the book, but as you said in your podcast, it may serve to set a mood of the Island being outside the normal bounds of ethics.

Great podcast guys, I really appreciate all your hard work on it.

[David]

Great Podcast guys! Except one thing, which I let go last time:

It's Cerberus (sirr-burr-uss), not Cerebus (Ser-ib-uss). Just a minor niggle I guess :)

[Cihan]

Good podcast as usual guys. Although I think everyone's getting carried away with the hyping up of Dharma, making theories about how Dharma schemed and somehow got everyone on the island. Think about how the writers would show this, it would be a hard sell, man. I think any way they write it, its going to look lame or cartoonish.

Poor Lost writers, they'll never meet everyone's expectations, lol.

I've got two theories going on at the moment, check them out:

[The Manmade Influence of Chaos Theory Theory]
http://lostpodcast.proboards2.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=1140391660

[The Dharma Plaebo Theory]
http://lostpodcast.proboards2.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=1144583747

Also: I agree with others that Libby's expression was just a signifier that she was having a flashback. I think Libby's got way too much flak ever since she appeared, lol.

[Andrea from Tulsa]

Hey guys! LOVE your podcast. I just wanted to address the Eko and church theory... A while back, he was marking the trees and saying that they were 'good'. I was suprised to see Eko later cutting down these trees. I wonder if the 'good' trees are blessed somehow and therefore make them a good choice to use in building a church. This came back to me when I saw him cross himself with the water in the bucket (whether it be correctly or incorrectly)...

Great work! Stay LOST!

[Rob]

It's a bit late, but you guys deserve major props for the Lockdown podcast. That map would be a major mystery for a lot of us w/o your research. I can't imagine the work that goes into prepping for an 1 hr 45 min podcast, but you guys do it every week and are consistently on point. Just want you guys to know its appreciated. Thanks.

[wuddlewaura]

They're called "Oyster crackers"!

[Pirate Guy]

Arrrrrrr. Thanks for the mention guys! Much appreciated!

[Randarr]

LOL, I see somebody already referenced this, but Cerebus is the aardvark character in Dave Sim's landmark independent comic book. :-)

It just goes to show how things change, though. I can remember when many people mispronounced Cerebus as Cerberus. Now we've gone full-circle.

[Reynaldo Davila]

Um I have a question about the food drop.
Why didnt the plane that suposely droped the box with food crash into the island like the oceanic flight did? The fact that it didnt makes me wonder if the pilots intentionaly crashed the plane into the island.

[tracic67]

First time poster, always been a listener. I just wanted to say thanks to you guys for the podcasts. Major Lost fan and major theorist. I tend to agree with a lot of what you guys say, plus what is out on the boards (most of the time). Every week, I have to argue and convince my roommates what is going on with Lost. Too bad I don't live near you (Orlando, FL). I am the girl you guys are looking for to spice things up in the podcasts. Stay Lost!

[Joe Green]

Hey guys. Another great podcast. Just wanted to say that I think Libby is being made out to be really evil and sinister when we don't really have any evidence of that. She has this reputation as a compulsive liar just because she said Hurley stepped on her foot.. he could have done. Even if he didn't, one little pork pie like that doesn't qualify her as an evil genious.

I don't think she's been stalking Hurley either. There have been alot of character connections in the show so far, but in almost every case the characters are unaware of the connections they share. I don't see why the writers would suddenly want to break this convention, nor do I see why this has to be any different with Libby and Hurley. They wouldnt have to see each other in the institution much - just enough to warrant Hurley asking if he recognised her (which he did). She looked so drugged up that she robably can't remember much in the way of faces from when she was there. It makes total sense that she could just like Hurley (with no master plan) and feel like nurturing him. This is behaviour we have seen from Locke's fiance (futurama lady a.k.a. peggy bundy) who looked after him after recovering from alcoholism herself.

I think that, all in all, Libby has been short changed with fan opinions of her. Most of the bad feeling towards her probably comes from some earlier feeling that there was something creepy about the tailies, a feeling which many fans have been unable to totally let go of.

Anyway, this post has gotten alot longer than I intended it to. Keep up the great work.

(p.s. if you feel like sending me some money for a flight I'd be happy to put on a dress and do the podcast with you guys :D)

[cole]

you guys mentioned that Libby "cleans up well for a crazy woman". Don't forget about the Bad Twin ideas. I've been hearing a lot of people on the island saying that "I'm not a BAD person", especially Henry Gale. I want to suggest that the Libby we saw in the institution is the Bad Twin of the Libby we know on the island.

[Christine @ MIT]

Regarding who could be the evil leader of the Others (the "him" or "he" the fake Henry Gale and Zeke are both referring to and quite terrified of), I think writers will make this person be someone we have seen on the show for maximum effect. Based on personality and previous shows, I think the most probable person is Locke's father. This would be consistent with the line "Are you him?" Locke's girlfriend states at the hotel. Then the finale may have Locke coming up in battle against his father. I think the leader of the Others will have to be linked in some way to all the Losties. I read a post by the producers somewhere that the Dharma Initiative has fallen into disrepair or disarray, which seems obvious given all the craziness on the island and the map, denoting the bad "incidents." From the film in the Hatch, the Dharma initiative seems to have "good" objectives, as opposed to the Others who seem to be "bad". Hence, maybe the Others attacked the island for whatever resource the Dharma Initiative had discovered there and tried to take it over. Maybe the "line" across the island represents half of it is controlled by the Others while the other half still has some Dharma activity like food drops doing on.

[BayAreaPeg]

That Spoiler that you gave at the end of the Dave lostcast was an April Fool

[korrinn]

libby probably has blond hair now because she is always in the sun... i'm a lifeguard in the summer and being in the sun can really bleach your hair...especially if you are going in salt water all the time...

[Shonda]

Hi, this is Number1Fan from thefuselage.com. I just found your podcast, and although I haven't heard them all yet, I'm already as hooked on ya'll as I am on the show, Lost. Scary, huh? I like your show way, way, waaaay better than the official Lost podcast - Carlton and Damon are too just persnickety at times.

You guys did a great job on both the Lockdown and Dave podcasts. So thorough! It sounds like ya'll have a lot of fun. You really DO need a girl on the show, though. Ya'll get a little caveman at times, but I don't mind. It is kinda cute. :)

I'd volunteer to be the token chick, but that would probably just make me even more unhealthily Lost-obsessive and then my family would hate me and I'd flunk out of nursing school and start making bad hair coloring decisions like nuthouse-Libby and things would just keep getting worse until someone found me blubbering in run-on-sentences in a hatch somewhere. So, no, you can't have me. But keep up the good work!

Props to the commentor above me that remembered Locke's mom was in the same institution as Libby, Hurley and Leonard. I mentioned it on the fuselage but nobody seemed to care. I'm glad I'm not the only one that noticed it, or thought it might be important.

I'm looking forward to the next podcast. :)

[Aethernon]

New listener, enjoy the podcast, [insert mindless sucking up here]

I just skimmed through the previous comments, so I don't know if this has been said yet, but the short story by Ursela K. Le Guin you reffered to in the podcast is called Omelas. Just thought I'd say so, because as a matter of fact I just read the short story a week ago.

[Chris]

It's already been mentioned numerous times, but I also started cracking up when I heard you guys reading Kristen's April Fool's joke in the spoiler section. You guys shouldn't feel too bad...apparently Daniel Dae Kim e-mailed her asking if it was actually true.

[Sigillum Dei Hemeth]

(Hey I posted this on the other one, but I think I posted it after the cut off date, so I don't know if anyone saw it; tell me what you guys think.)

First of all the only practical reason (I don't think this has been brought) that the UV ray lights would be in the hatch, is because the human body needs sunlight (specifically UV rays) to produce needed vitamin D. Without it, or specifically sunlight, the human body can produce rickets or various other bone diseases. This is the reason that children in countries like Iceland, Greenland and the North are dosed with UV rays during the dark season. It would make sense the lights in the hatch were placed there for a similar purpose.

Secondly, why does everyone assume that the blast doors weren't placed there to prevent the button from being pushed. Remember when Desmond asked the castaways when it was that they crashed, and when they told him it seemed like he was counting back in his head. I think that the blast doors went down and prevented him from pushing the button on the day they crashed or around that day, And he made that connection in his head. Maybe the blast doors are supposed to keep whoever is in the hatch from being able to access the button, just so an external force can interact with the island, Such a as a supply drop or a plane crash. It's only sloppy engineering that they were able to get through the air event. I bet that voice, which was unable to be understood, used to say something like. “Danger alert, possible contamination. Move to the recreation room.”

There would be no reason anyone would dispute it, or try to find away to reach the button in such a circumstance.

Only a thought.

[Art Vandelei]

In response to the spoiler that would have locke killed (Joke or not), I think its not that crazy an idea. After all, all the self confidence and the content you could expect from Locke over the first season seems to be vanishing. He now looks so weak and vulnerable and human. He used to be more enigmatic, and the only guy you could expect to understand at least some of what was happening. The kind of feeling I now get from Mr. Eko. So maybe (and I dont mean I like the idea) locke isnt as vital to the story and mostly to the group as he used to be.

[Kane]

I think that someone should make a map of the island depending in episodes and the blast door map.

You are talking about "the incident" in many podcasts. In the series is the incident mentioned anywhere else but in the b/w Dharma film? (I haven't listened the very first of your podcasts, maby the answer is in there) If it isn't mentioned anywhere else, I don't think you should base on that very much. It maby just something to scare the workers not to touch the CPU.

I'm still in podcast 23, so I'm sorry if I speak something you have already talked about.

I really need to go to work now. Bye!
Greetings from Finland, Kane!

[Kathy aka Fangirl]

I was listening to the podcast and I realized something. The Others seem to be fond of snapping necks. So far three people have died of broken necks at the hands of the Others. 1st was Scott (or is it Steve), second was the guy Goodwin took out and now we know that the real Henry Gale's neck was also snapped. Not sure if it has any real significance, but just seems noteworthy.

I have to throw out the idea that the real Henry Gale's signal fire was the one Danielle saw. That was 16 years ago so his driver's license would have been expired long before 2003 unless Minnesota has longer renewals. :)

[rubycalaber]

A FEMALE? What madness is this? I'm sorry but this is TRUE LUNACY! Only homoerotic nerds can make podcasts about sci-fi TV shows. If she is gay this may keep some sort of equilibrium. Trust me, letting a hetrosexual female into our community is like handing Germany back to the nazis. Trust me. I'm from the internet sirs. Good work!

[ursinha]

hey, i posted this the other night, but didn't make the cut-off, and am interested to hear what others think. i added more editorial.

**why were the losties chosen?
it seems clear that the losties are part of a study. they were chosen as they are "bad" in some way. maybe they are more predisposed for irrational behavior, agressiveness, craziness, poor judgement (i.e., bad)? some of these people are obviously not who you would consider "bad" however some of these losties may still be on the list to be taken or we just don't know their complete backstories yet. this is also confirmed as eko, even though he was once "bad," is now redeemed--so he is good. didn't the others try and take him? if we find out that rose and bernard (who made me actually cry about the candy bars) have a sordid past we can possibly assume the losties were chosen b/c of their "badness." why are there so many connections among the losties though? very robert altman.

**what is the study about?
it seems like they are testing some sort of chemical or virus (hence the sickness, hallucinations, and emphasis on the vaccines in maternity leave, etc.). could it be environmental effects of the island? could it be the food that they are eating (i think it's the food)? i think there have been other groups of losties that have died off because of the experiment.

**who are the others?
it seems like the others are pawns of dharma/windmere, and part of the experiment too. they have been fed that they are 'good' though. they need the losties
to participate in the experiment for whatever reason. they been there a while and want to leave...they've been there at least 16 years as alex was taken as a baby.
i think zeke is the leader of the others, but battles the head person at dharma/windmere. henry gale is an other, and was possibly intentional captured to gather information from the losties.

**the map:
i think it was left there by other groups of losties; for whatever reason they left behind some clues. the others are just as curious to understand the meaning of the map as they are in the same predicament. could be why henry gale questioned locke and jack so much.

[bonneville]

I like Doubling T's suggestion that the hatch is monitored and Gale is aware of it...this would explain not only his reluctance to give up any info, but also that whole "Of course if I WAS one of these Others..." monologue. If he knew his cronies were listening, that could have been Gale's sneaky way of giving them the message to take a lostie prisoner in order to force a later trade.

Also, regarding whether it was Hurley's or Libby's flashback at the end--I've noticed sometimes a character's flashback doesn't necessarily only show the things they themselves experienced. Sun's flashback for example included Jin's interactions apart from her; with his friend, the hotel manager, and the orange dress girl.

Another great podcast, and I'm glad to find out that spoiler was an April fool's joke...

[bonneville]

Also, the idea of Locke's dad having a Dharma connection (I know that was part of the April Fool's spoiler) is not so crazy...The Oceanic plane flying by twice seemed to be some kind of vague foreshadowing, not to mention him carrying that Oceanic bag...

[Kathy aka Fangirl]

I meant to ask this earlier - has anyone compared a screen grab of Danielle's map and compared it to the Hatch map? I know it wouldn't match exactly, but one might help explain the other.

Speaking of Oceanic in the post above - I've never heard you guys mention the fact that in the training film there is an Oceanic Logo on the bookcase in one of the shots. Seems suspicious to me.

[Jenni Lou]

Well, it's not Danielle's map but it was constructed based on the info the series has given us...you can check out a map that superimposes the hatch map onto the island here:

http://www.blackrock.nl/content/view/24/42/

The site has tons of maps to look out. Definitely worth a look.

[Antonio]

Where is the Canadian Promo?

[Avatar]

"Meanwhile, Eko continues building in the jungle and reveals to Charlie that he's constructing a church, enlisting his help."

htis was taken from ABC's website, from the episode 18 recap. That would explain most peoples idea that Eko is indeed building a church, even thoug it was nerver really said in the episode. If you guys read the diary, how come you miss the recaps?

[Victor]

Hi Guys,
I was hoping to listen to the podcast today, but it seems the location is down ?

[David]

You can find the Canadian promo here:

http://lostlinks.net/

[Challabuck]

Great pontification, fellas. Glad I found ye. One thing I can't let go of, though, is the polaroid discrepencies. I simply refuse to chalk it up to a production error as you seemed to write off. No way. The producers have made it clear too often that they pay careful attention to these things. Maybe they put in those discrepencies to f#*k with the minds of folks like us, but there's no way they didn't do it on purpose. More than the day vs. night difference, the thing that stood out for me was the plate of food on the table in front of Hurley. In one shot, there's a spominent piece of cake. In the other, it's a burrito or something. I'm hoping, in any case, that the night polaroid shot WAS different. That would make the whole thing that much more interesting.

[The Colonel]

Say... has anybody been here?

http://www.widmorelaboratories.com/

Looks like they're in league with DHARMA- so much for corporate feuds.

What's the deal with the all of infinity jargon?

Quite interesting. Sheds light on a few things, any thoughts?

[The Colonel]

Only thing is, it's registered to some guy in Indiana...

Likely a complete dupe.

[ObviousJack]

In regards to this site,

http://www.widmorelaboratories.com/

it is hosted by Yahoo and in no way affiliated with the Disney Media Net like the other official sites were.

Sites like these should be viewed with appreciation to fan commitment not as any form of canon information.

[Dark Hurley]

You know, for one plane ride, there sure were alot of murderers on board. On first count I have Ana Lucia, Kate, Sawyer and Eko. Indirectly, actions by Jack and Hurley also resulted in deaths. I can't remember if Sayid has actually been shown killing someone, but there's the whole torture thing. Charlie has murdered someone since he's been on the island. Non-murders (so far) include Jin, Sun, Locke, Claire, Libby, Rose and Bernard. Anyone I'm missing? I've realized this for awhile, but I never really considered it signicant until Hurley's flashback this week.

[angstboy]

RE: Libby as a DHARMA plant.

First, great Cast you guys. I'm totally addicted.

Anyway, I'm of the opinion that Libby is, in fact, a DHARMA plant placed in the mental institution to keep tabs on Hurley. If we are to believe that the castaways were purposefully directed to the island, for whatever reason, it would follow that those from the DHARMA Initiative would likely be guiding all of their subjects to their eventual arrival at the island. If the island is a part of a greater experiment in "scientifically controlled destiny" there's no telling how far back the experiment actually goes and could reach back into each castaway's past for many many years. We've already seen the levels of dedication that the Others/DHARMA Initiative members have for the project and the lengths they'll go to achieve their goals. Ethan and "Not Henry" were able and willing to take great deals of punishment and even face death for the goals of the project. They were both skilled liars and deceivers. Based on those characteristics alone, Libby could be posing as just another castaway, when in fact, it's been her "mission" to make sure that Hurley got on the plane from Australia. If that included pretending to be crazy and taking meds in order to do so, it seems consistent with DHARMA practices that she'd be more than willing to do it for the good of the project.

So basically, it's possible that Libby's a skilled manipulator in charge of keeping tabs on Hurley for DHARMA, who was never really crazy at all.

[rubycalaber]

I have a Polaroid camera and when taken indoors the photo comes out rather darkened like if the lights were turned down so maybe it’s the chemicals in the production of the photo has an effect on the light. Or it hadn’t finished developing?

[challabuck]

I'll grant the darkened room explanation, but what about the food on the table? There's something else at play. It just ain't that simple.

[Mark B]

Challabuck --

OK I look at the original and the polaroid and the food looks the same to me -- it's the celery that Hurley was eating. Now that said there seems to be more celery in the original than in the photo. The only thing that worries me is the bloke in the background is gone or is he hiding in the shadows. I think the point here is that the Dr delibratly used a polaroid rather than a digital camera so we KNOW Dave is imaginary. If they'd used a digital camera then everyone would have been screaming "PHOTOSHOP !!" I mean Hurley even said to Dave about the photo and Dave used that as an excuse.

If for sake of arguement we think this is not some kind of production error (which I think it is) then we have to think every little detail is up for scrutiny --- go back to White Rabbit. The scene where Jack sees his Dad knee deep in the sea. Look at the beach -- one set of footprints. When Jack looks again his Dad has gone but two sets of footprints are clearly on the beach. So Jacks Dad is alive and well and is probably having a Dharma picnic with Desmond, Micheal and Walt.

....... SPOILER WARNING .....
Face the facts people Lost is a tv show, it's not real. Production errors are bound to slip in.

[Matt Jones]

rubycalaber,

Post of the week.

Lostcasters,

Love the Lostcasts Theater interpretive readings. Maybe for the summer you could just read the season one transcripts.

[Pomegranate]

Dudes.
Here's my take on the photo inconsistencies: We don't see the ACTUAL Polaroid until the doc takes it out of Hurley's file. Before that we're seeing from roughly the doc's point of view, but no view of the actual photo he took with Dave in it. The 'before' photo posted above is a screen shot, and the 'after' is a screen shot of the actual photo as Hurley is holding it.
The guy sitting at the table in the 'before' shot is there in the 'after,' he's just really dark. And the doctor was standing off to Hurley's left (our right as viewers), which is why they're looking off to the side rather than directly at us. That's also why darkened dude in the back is more behind Hurley in the 'after.' Also, the camera's at their eye level while the doctor is standing, which is why we see Hurley's lap and pj pants in the 'after' but not in the 'before.'

These aren't really inconsistencies, as such, just different views of the same scene. And having taken tons of bad pictures, I can attest to the tendency for them to turn out dark. And I'm willing to attribute stuff like the celery being stacked different and the Connect Four pieces being scattered different to production errors.

Ok. Commence attack. I'm ready (I think).

[Annie]

The BIG spoiler was an april fool's joke from Watch With Kristin on EONLINE! haha just thought u would want to know.

[RD]

Not sure if it's too late to comment on "Dave".

Anybody notice how all of the food in that Dharma drop seemed to be comfort food? Maybe it's just a coincidence that that's all that we saw, but, sheesh: chocolate bars, ranch dip, goldfish crackers, peanut butter, oreos, mac & cheese... Seems like Desmond was making some sort of smoothie in this season's premiere, but maybe that wasn't official Dharma stuff? I think Hurley mentioned he had some pears, but still, that ain't exactly asparagus or lima beans.

I wonder if this is part of some sort of B.F. Skinner-esque operant conditioning? Maybe all of the sugar and simple carbs in all this comfort food is meant to lull the losties in some way?

I didn't really remark on the food that much the first time the losties got in the hatch, especially after it all seemed to have been blown on that big party, but now that it has made a reappearance, this occurred to me today while listening to your podcast. It's amazing how much the food has distracted everybody in this episode. Much was made of Hurley's eating disorder in this episode and in past episodes, but it really struck me watching Sawyer futz with that oreo how everybody was focused on the food. Also, the faux Henry Gale's comment two episodes ago about how the losties aren't asking too many questions; he made the comment while he was inspecting a box of Dharma-O's. I wonder if that was done self-consciously. Now that I think about it, the image of Kate squirming around in the vents above the pantry remind me of a Skinner box: a constrained environment (the maze-like qualities of the vents and even the hatch itself) with reinforcements (e.g. all this tempting food).

Sorry for the long post, and I hope this isn't a well-worn idea by now. I listen to most of the Lost podcasts, and I don't remember hearing anyone mention this.

Great podcast; keep up the good work!

[redfraggle]

All I really wanted to say was YAY for great music taste. I wasn't expecting that at all. Not that you guys don't seem like you would have good music taste, I was just surprised at the great indie-taste. I'm definitely going to check out the Black Angels when they come to NYC. Excellent!!

I love your podcast and anxiously await it every week.

[goat]

The entire 'a beautiful mind' idea with dave was a transparent disappointment from the get-go, IMO. I wish there were less time spent on the Hurley backstory, and more with Henry Gale and the blastdoor map. oh well.
As far as the podcast is concerned, I really enjoyed the comparison of the island to hell- I think there could be something to that theory. Libby - not an 'other', maybe a stalker, but definitely remembers hurley from the nuthouse.

[Tilandra]

It's possible that the reason Ekko crossed himself incorrectly was because the only religious learning he had was when he was a small child, and so now he's remembering it wrong.

Regarding the Zenmaster story... perhaps at some point in time that's where the black and white stones found by Adam and Eve will figure in. Reach into a bag and pull out a stone. See if the figment/ghost/whatever can tell you what color it is.

If the polaroid was a production error, then why didn't they use the one the actor actually took on the set? If it was intentional, could it mean that the doctor and the Santa Rosa institution are part of the Hanso group conspiracy? Daytime vs. Nighttime is a pretty big error to make, and prop "mistakes" seem to be piling up.

Perhaps the reason why Libby doesn't have roots on the island is because the hair color in the institution was her dyed color. If she was emulating a doctor as part of her craziness, then maybe she dyed it to match whomever she was copying (a la "Single White Female").

Do the Black Angels have MySpace space?

[Cameron]

Well the official podcast is out - and it sucked big time. I'm guessing that that's not exactly a spoiler for anyone here.

[Joe Green]

Tilandra, they couldn't use the polaroid taken on set because Dave would be in it.

[mark b]

Well the official podcast is once again pretty lame. Perhaps we expect too much. I guess they can't theorise too much as they know the answers so all they can do is nswer questions which they have to be careful with so not to give anything away.

I thpught the last question was the only really interesting thing (paraphrase):
"If someone came up with the right theory would the writers change the storyline ?" Answer (also paraphrase) "No. Some of the theories out there incorporate some of the right theory but then go all whacko".

Also what's this about a brand new re-cap episode "Reckoning" on April 26th ?

[Mr_Hurley's Food Stash]

Just listening to the podcast 'Dave' and listening to you talk about Henry Gale.

When they are interrogating Henry Gale, he seems to hesitate and speaks quietly when talking about the others and what will happen to him. It's like he knows they are listening to them so he can't talk about anything specific, this also goes back in with the feedback on the speakers in 'lockdown'. One of you guys mentioned that the feedback like that usually comes from a microphone being close to the speakers (I think). I'm not sure if this has been mentioned or if it's that important and I haven't checked all the comments but it's been said that 'the others' always know what they are doing. I might of just imagined this though, I'm bored in work and I need to see the episode again...need to download it on limewi....errr...Itunes and check! Anyway, back to gathering food for Hurley.

Mr Hurley's Food Stash
(P.S No fun at Hurley, he's one of my favorite characters and who hasn't had an imaginary friend called Dave! Come on!…what’s that Dave..we need to download that episode now…ok..coming…sorry got to go!)

[Tilandra]

Re: the polaroid... AUGH! One of those days where the gears aren't all working in my brain, lol.

[Kathy aka Fangirl]

This is going back to the map, but I thought of something. If people can come to the island to make inspections/visits, then that means that there are ways to come and go from the island.

If so, is it possible that Claire's boyfriend is Calvin? If he left the island, Desmond would think he was dead. It would explain the mural. It would explain why Dharma is so interested in Claire's baby.

Just a random thought that popped into my head at lunch. Thoughts?

[The Andrew]

The offical lost podcast is getting worse i never thought i would say that.

[Sarah Perez]

My theory on this ep:

Hurley's not crazy - Dave and the doctor are both Dharma guys and are MESSING with him. I've heard a lot of "you can't photoshop a polaroid" comments on the forums and from friends, and to that I say: These people has a Cerebus running around reading minds! Don't you think they might have figured out some technology to fix a Polaroid?!

I'm torn between thinking Libby is a pathological liar and that she *is* a clinical psychiatrist. Let's say she is a clinical psychiatrist -- then possibly, she caught onto whatever evil deeds Hurley's doc was up to (maybe he was a fake?), so he took care of her by drugging her to death to the point she didn't know what was going on at all. But either way, doc or patient, what was she doing on the plane in the 1st place?

And finally -- Libby is a natural blonde, she's not dying her hair on the island! The red-headed, drugged-up Libby is sporting the fake color. Why is everyone assuming it's the other way around?

[Clockworkjones]

A couple quick theories:

I agree with Sarah Perez's comment that it's possible Hurley really isn't insane and that Dharma is messing with him. Or possibly he was insane to some small degree initially and that Dharma is using him in an experiment. Could Dave in fact be an actual person that they have convinced Hurley is not real? I believe that Hurley is definately halucinating Dave at the time the picture is taken, but most illusions like dreams have some basis in reality. There could also be a Widmore connection here. There has been much speculation that Widmore is a rival group to Dharma. I feel that Libby could actually be a Widmore agent spying on the Dharma experiment. In line with this I believe that the real Henry Gale did not crash on the island accidentally. I think he too was spying on Dharma and crashed during his reconnisance mission. And the message to Jennifer on the bill? It's fake. I think he was captured by Dharma, subsequently killed and the note written by the fake Henry and company left as a red herring. I dont think the fake Henry would have sent Anna Lucia out to find the balloon and grave if there was something there he didn't want them to find.
Finally, Matt Jones made a comment way back in Lostcast 5 or six about Danielle's scientific expedition and how they may have been spying on the Dharma group. Could Danielle's expedition have been yet another Widmore group doing just that?

Thanks and keep up the great lostcasts.

[Matt Jones]

Unless Dave is a cliff diver I doubt that he is real. He's in Hurley's head. The doctor wasn't tricking him. The polaroid wasn't fake. Now Dharma could be using his illness to their own ends, but I believe that Hurley is a messed up dude. Dude.

Clockworkjones,

If the Widmore vs Dharma rivalry theory holds up then I deninitely think that Danielle's team could have been sent by Widmore. Maybe Real Henry was sent to find out what happened to them. I really like the idea that there is a showdown for the, as Brian put it, intelectual property of the island.

[Ryan]

Hey! GREAT Podcast guys.

I think you shafted me a little with the on air depiction of the events - but that's cool.

I agree with the map being the 4rth caster.

Also, I knew that there was 3 original casters. It was just a slip, your not that forgettable dude.

Also, when one of you guys are gone Jones rules. Wasn't dissing any one specific caster. Just the total number of.

Great cast! Interested to see this weeks lost ep. My expectations are HIGH if this last one was a build up ep.

[Ryan]

Oh - and I don't care if the wiz theory is common, it would be AMAZING if Gale is the Wiz!!!

[Ryan]

Hey if you guys need help installing the forum let me know. I do that kind of stuff for living. Would be pretty easy to make it look like this too.

[Matt Jones]

I think the Wizard theory is pretty cool as well. Wouldn't piss me off in the least.

[mark b]

I think Lost is so original that people are expecting something original every week and using a similar theme from another show/book/film would be seen as selling out. Borrowing ideas from other media is bound to happen. The Wiz theory is OK by me but I'd like to see a twist on the way. Though I wonder where they will go after the Losties have discovered Gale is the big man.

The final final episode is, I am already sure, going to be either a huge let down or the best two hours of tv ever. As I've said before I have nightmares about a two hour show packed with half answers or a black screen appearing at the end of a season with the words "The survivors of Oceanic Flight 815 were never rescued."

[Matt Jones]

Will the final explanation, assuming we get one, ever satisfy everyone? People have invested so much in this show it is almost guaranteed to be a letdown when the curtain is finally pulled back. The creators will have truly accomplished no small feat if the final episode leaves 75% of the audience happy. Think of the last episode of Seinfeld. I loved it, but most considered it a cop-out.

IMO, the Dharma thread is just scratching the surface of what's happening on the island. I think most Dharma/Hanso/Widmore questions will be answered by the end of season 4. I think the last two seasons will delve deeper into the mysterious nature of the Island itself.

[Isaac]

I too think that we are only scratching the surface right now. I like how we very slowly, through the seasons, going from an ant-level view up to (maybe) a bird's eye view of the nature of the island. Because it's not about Dharma/Widmore/Hanso, it's about The Island. Remember what we knew in the first moment when Jack opened his eyes in the jungle compared to our knowledge now. We peel another layer off the onion as time goes by. And it would be cool if the whole Dharma business is part of something even bigger (but I might be pushing it).

[Ryan]

"I think the Wizard theory is pretty cool as well. Wouldn't piss me off in the least"

See? Jones and I are TIGHT. There was no lost(ehem) love.

One reason it would be great is that he is by far the best actor on the show. Also, the show REALLY needs a villian.

From a story standpoint it just makes good drama. This villian is brave enough to come in there and risk his life to accomplish his mission. And, he is smart enough to manipulate every single lostie while they have the upper hand. (Anyone who was offended by my geeky comments get ready for this:) I think he has the potential to be Q level bad@$$ in terms of TV series villains. I want him to stick around.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If it really is up to losing Gale, or losing Charlie and Mr. Clean, I would keep Gale and I will be rooting for him.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Matt Jones]

In case you missed the lemonade comment in the other thread...

We cooler than a polar bears toenails Ryan.

[james De Mass]

did anybody notice the black rock behind them when Jack n freckles went for the trade????????

Black Rock + Black Rock seems like a connection

james

[james De Mass]

and the black rocks on the SOS sign

allot of black rocks in this episode

james

[Errockk]

Anyone see that Hurley's run in with Dave was similiar to Tyler Durden in the movie and book fight club?

[Glyn]

Sorry if this sounds picky, but on the podcast you guys keep pronouncing the word "Cerberus" (Sur-buh-russ or Kur-buh-russ) as "Cerebus" (Suh-ruh-bus). Cerebus was/is a comic-strip aardvark created by Dave Sim and his name came from an accidental misspelling of Cerberus. Where the mythological three-headed dog is concerned however the middle syllable is definitely "buh" and not "ruh". Not so importantly the first syllable had a k in Greek and was probably pronounced with a hard "c" in Latin but the soft "c" has become the norm in English pronunciation. Thanks for listening. Keep up the good banter.

[Anderson Cooper]

Mr. Eko is building a gallows. Believe it.

[George Dupin]

I love your podcast, but one problem I found in the podcast for 'Dave' was that you seemed to be thinking that Libby was STILL crazy. The likliness is, that she was in Santa Rosa a while ago, and just like Hurley, a lot of things have happened to her since.

Keep up the good work. (:

[Pafid]

halo paff goz esal guzu chos magumbo