LOSTCasts 38: Further Instructions

John and Matt are back for this podcast on season 3, episode 3 of LOST, Further Instructions. In the podcast this week, we talk about general reactions to the episode, including a conversation about fans over-analyzing the show (um... of course). We also discuss Locke's backstory, as well as his vision and search for Mr. Eko. We also explore the implications of that vision, and talk about the implications that vision might have on the larger story of the island, our survivors and the others. Of course, this podcast would not be complete without a little discussion on Desmond's new "psychic" abilities. As always, we've got a ton of LOST links, and some information about the new episode coming up this week.

Download podcast #38 here

Links related to the podcast:
General reactions from The Fuselage
Comparison of Jack vs. Locke in opening scene
Closeup of Mr. Eko's stick
Post on The Fuselage about Mr. Eko's stick
Post on The Fuselage about hatch implosion
Transcript for Further Instructions
Wikipedia entry for Altered States

LOST Links:
Screencaps of Amex LOST content
Maxim's LOST map
Wikipedia rival being launched
Nightline interview with LOST writers
Article on LOST Channel 4/Sky switch
Locke You Stole My Kidney Shirt from Lon Chan

Join us next week!

Stay LOST.

Comments

[Petos]

Fantastic!

Downloading now for my train commute into work on Monday.

In the UK, Sky have bought the rights to the show from Channel 4, so it will only be one week behind the US.

Lost rules!

[delilah]

re: brian in arizona's email.

thank you!! my thought's exactly, articulated much better than i ever could. this last episode was ruined for me because i spent the whole time worrying about what negative things people might have to say about it on the boards. i have no problem with criticism of an episode, as long as its justified and reasonable. if i hear the phrase "jump the shark" one more time im going to loose it.

(i love the podcast though, and would never group john, robert or matt with any of the complainers on any of the forums)

[Jon W]

This great news for us UK fans, but I may still download it online, because the advert breaks will still be really bad.

[Cihan]

lmao@the new crackpot theory of Ben's gang protecting their weed stash. :D

[crapjohnson]

When you guys were talking about the bear you were saying "well why did it drag him back to the cave alive, why didn't it gut him and eat him in the woods like the other animal?" The answer, to me, is simple.

Because the writers wanted to place Eko in danger in this episode but not kill him.

I know Lost is a complex show but sometimes, you gotta think simple.

[Cihan]

I REALLY dont understand people complaining about the introduction of the two new characters, with viewers complaining about a lack of a scene with them introducing themselves. Introducing themselves!? These guys have been on the island for over a month, everyone knows each other now! The audiences introduction to the characters was seamless in my opinion, I mean seriously I dont get the flak. If the first time we see these new characters is with some dramatic entrance or them giving their names, now THAT would have been awkward and illogical.

[Cihan]

I'd never heard of a 'tie-dye' before seeing this episode btw, I just wiki'd it and its interesting and slightly random, I mean where did Hurley get it? Did he make it on the island (what did he use for dye?) or was it luggage from the plane crash or what?

The designs for tie-dyes look trippy. There was a heavy drug theme in this episode, huh? Locke's paste, his drug family, the tie-dye...

[Mike in the Box]

I just listened and wanted to thank you for using my "tunnels under the hatch" thought. after looking at the pic again, i realize that there are in fact 3 tunnels (for lack of a better word). one at 12 oclock, on at 3 oclock and one at 9 oclock.

[SmokeMonster]

@Kathy aka Fangirl
haha, maybe I'm in denial...I just dont know anymore

[kristenS.(not kristen from e-online)]

hi all, ive listened to the podcast since its start, but have never joined in the talk on the comments section before. well ive got a bit of 'gossipy' lost info, i thought i just might as well put it out here [it might be good for one of those matt jones comments ;) ] while digging around on the site posted by Midnight, i came across that the actress who playes kate, and the actor who plays charlie, are going to get married. heres the link to the article: http://www.buddytv.com/articles/lost/losts_lilly_and_monaghan_to_ma.aspx

anyone up for some charlie and kate luuvee?? ; )
(once locke the paste man brings her back, of course)

[Raz Minder]

Re: Nikki and Paulo

I didn't have a problem with how or when they were introduced (though, you can tell that a prior scene was cut), but I did find the clunky dialogue handed to them awkward. I think John, in the podcast, was right when he said that the final scene seemed a bit rushed - given the needed exposition (explaining what happened to Jack and company, etc.) and the likely time constraints (we have no idea how many scenes and bits of expository dialogue hit the cutting-room floor in every episode), the writers had a difficult scene to compose.

It really is nitpicking - but I thought it was odd that Paulo didn't know who "they" were; like he needed to be reminded of the Others. And Nikki jumping all over Hurley won't exactly endear her to the viewers. It just could have been handled in a different way. Arzt was better introduced, for example, as he provided useful information to the raft plot.

All and all, that is minor (a bigger deal is Charlie's quick forgiveness of Locke; sure, Eko was in trouble, but Charlie really didn't care much for him at the end of last season). This type of character continuity bothers me more than anything else, but that's just me.

Re: Eddie/Ben as the infiltrator

BTW, the leader of the hippie commune was Mike, not Eddie (he was the cop). Anyway, I liked how they paralleled the roles of Eddie (pre-island) and Ben (on-island) in Locke’s storyline.

Boone brought up the idea of putting the family back together – starting with Eko, of course. Both Eddie and Ben infiltrated Locke’s “family,” so to speak. As we know, Locke is always far too entrusting – he bought Ben’s idea that the button did nothing, which caused a major clusterf*ck, and he invited Eddie into the commune (though, everyone did; not sure why Locke receives all the blame there).

I take away a completely different outlook from this episode. If anything, Locke is going to rescue Jack, Kate and Sawyer from the Others – thus putting the “family” back together as Boone suggested. I don’t think this episode was supposed to give us the idea that he would join the Others family, though it’s certainly possible. Like Matt Jones said, Locke is looking for familial companionship, so he is susceptible to anyone or anything that rubs his ego the right way. But I see him as a changed man – he’s no longer the farmer.

Great podcast, as usual.

[jg]

Mike “The Duke of Potville” and Tom (aka Zeke) of “Othersville" are not the same guy. http://humpys.net/view_pic.php?id=255&season=3

Thanks for the whining discussion.

Perhaps Locke’s unsavory experience with the dope growers has left him with a disdain for recreational dope users like Charlie. Therefore, the vigorous smack down of Charlie of an earlier Episode.

Whereas I’m sure some of the “others” are ancient, with some being survivors of the “Black Rock” and even to the date of the ‘4 toed’ statue. Though perhaps only the soul of Ben is that old. The intriguing statement of Ben to Juliette “you never made me soup” makes me think he was a captive once. So far I think Ben is an evil genius. Maybe he has used the “get captured to infiltrate” ploy before, as with the DHARMA scientists. He is not all knowing but is brilliant at manipulating people.

I don’t have the patience to find “adam”s or “ilovesayid”s maps. So I don’t know if true north is at the top of the maps or not. But, I would concur that given the time of day in the Opener, and the sun orientation; “Othersville” is south of the crash sites. Time of day of ‘book club’ and crash is afternoon or early evening with the sun on the right we are looking north to the crash sites.

jg

[Raz Minder]

Forgot to add that Jack may join the Others (if that is their goal), though I'm hoping for Jack to lull the Others into a trap. It's getting a bit depressing with the Others always outsmarting our supposed protagonists.

[jg]

The sun is on the left.
sorry.
That would would make us looking north over "Othersville" toward the crash sites.
Apologies.
jg

[Daniel Louden]

This is my first comment and I'll start it by saying I love the podcast and look forward to it every week. That said let me move into my issue:

The ground ball through Buckners legs did not lose the game for Boston in the 1986 world series. Had he fielded the ball cleanly the game would have gone to the top of the 11th. The game was tied in the top of the 10th when Dave Henderson hit a 3 run homer. In the bottom of the tenth Boston got 2 quick outs then the mets began to rally. If you want to blame someone for losing that game blame Calvin Schiraldi who was responsible for the baserunners that scored; or blame Bob Stanley who relieved Schiraldi and threw a wild pitch that let the Mets tie the game. Frankly, had Buckner fielded the ball cleanly Wilson still would have had a chance at being safe at first, since Buckner was playing back, had bad ankles and was notoriously slow, as opposed to Mookie Wilson, who was known for his speed.

As a huge baseball fan and also a huge lost fan I just felt the need to clarify that. Once again, keep up the good work.

[Wisdo]

May sound unbeliveably fanboyish but I look forward to the podcast as much as the show. Its part of the whole Lost thing. The Lost experience if you will. Or wont. And Carter/ Valenzetti equation notwithstanding I do hope that our own particular group of human beings, the puzzlers the riddlers and culture voyagers manage to retain some cohesion after this is allover.

For me it is all over. The Lost experience placed the capstone on an idea I had for sometime based on an old Brian Aldiss novel;. Dont bother, its an allegory and I would never "spoiler" like that anyway. Hey for that matter try Tom Clancy's "Rainbow Six", probably closer to the mark in terms of McGuffin. But the Lost Experience wasnt the end for me.

No sir.

The end was watching a DVD my friend made of a compliation from Season 1 and 2 of battlestar Galactica. Apparently its a remake of an old cheesy 70's series. Well this is the furthest thing from cheese.. its ... electricity. Now tonight I watched the first 4 eps of season3, and I have to day.. man that is writing. Its got me exited about the prose of it again, about the sudden unexpected emotions, nuances, backstory as multiplier on the emotional payload.

Suffice to say - sadly - Lost is is No2. Galactica is now my main fix.

Sadly? no - gladly.

[Wisdo]

Oh BTW? I was the guy asking if baseball was a variant of criket. Sorry! I dont watch any sports at all. So I dont know anything about baseball. But I was proved correct to ask that question because it turned out that Jacks dad HAD commented on this team b4 (thats why the Redsox will NEVER win).

It wasnt some anti american or anti baseball thing.

So... why do you call that ball throwing game "football"? is it a variant of Football?

Lol.

[Wisdo]

last comment... the 16 million viewers? Thats on the night in america. Actual viewrship worldwide (going by uptake of the DVD purchases) 112,750,000.

I never even heard of those other shows you mention.

[Matt Jones]

Daniel Louden,

Thanks for clearing things up. I'm a baseball fan myself, but not a hardcore one. With the Texas Rangers as my team can you really blame me?

Buckner did get a bum rap. Lots of Sox screwed the pooch in that series. Unfortunately Buckner's was the most telegenic screw up. Poor bastard. If I remember corectly his life really went to crap after that. Boston fans never let him live it down. His name even became a verb.

Bucknered - To blow an easy opportunity spectacularly.

Wisdo,

I have heard Galactica is fantastic TV. I have just never caught up with it. DVD time I guess. You should check out a few of the old series just to compare. It was a product of Star War's success. Cheesy, but not as cheesy as Buck Rodgers. I loved it when I was a kid.

To confess, I wouldn't say LOST is my favorite TV show. I don't really like to rank art beyond stuff I love, stuff I like, stuff I'm indifferent to and stuff I hate. (There is also a sub-category for TV called stuff my wife watches that I pretend not to like but actually enjoy far more than I want to admit.) LOST certainly falls under stuff I love, but there are a lot of other great shows in that category.

Crapjohnson,

It could be a simple as a plot device, but I really think the whole save Ecko from the bear scenario was the Island helping Locke get is groove back. There were just too many inconcistancies in it's behavior. I hope the writers are better than that.

[Matt Jones]

Wisdo,

We didn't take it as an insult to Baseball, Mom and Apple Pie.

But all the same...

Watch your ass foreigner! :-)

[Matt Lafferty]

Well... here's what I get for listening to the podcast before bed: I can't sleep! It was a top notch 'cast as usual!

I have to say... one thing that might be keeping me up is the mental image of John's theory of children in the bear cave. I think that Lost has a lot of potential to be scary the way X-Files could be--the first monster attack waaaay back in episode one is good evidence of that, as well as when Jin introduced the tailies as Others in season 2. Imagine that, for whatever reason, they go back into the bear cave or it's night in the jungle or what have you, and out of the darkness come a ragged group of creepy kids--and one is holding The Teddy Bear.

jg,
"The Duke of Potville." Awesome moniker!!!

crapjohnson and Matt Jones,
I've got to go with crapjohnson concerning why Eko wasn't bitten: they, like, need him for the show!

Speaking of Matt Jones... and possible twin/clone theories... has anyone else noticed that there are a ton of Matts who post on here? Mr. Jones, myself, Matt Beale, a Matt H as I recall, etc... freaky.

[Kim]

I haven't even finished listening to the podcast yet (which is my favorite podcast even though Lost isn't my favorite show), but Brian's e-mail really had me rolling my eyes. Some people enjoy picking apart the show and discussing what they didn't like and some people don't, it really is that simple. The fact that I hated The Glass Ballerina and think Sayid's plan was stupid doesn't mean that Brian or anyone else can't think Sayid's an awesome genius and TGB was a classic episode. Part of the enjoyment of television for me is interacting with it and that means I'm going to shout it to the rooftops if I think the writers are on crack. If that's really going to ruin your enjoyment of the show maybe you should avoid the sort of places on the internet where people like to talk about things. Also this isn't new, every show ever that's had any sort of internet following has the people who bitch about the show and the people who bitch about people who bitch about the show.

[Joop]

Kim, you go girl!

Another great podcast. Thanks for the link to the Nightline interview. It was cool to see the writers vent their frustration w/ the abc execs, comparing them to the Pope telling Michaelangelo "your'e not done yet. More paint. More paint." For me it kinda put our quiblings as fans into perspective.

Matt, Thanks for defending baseball, mom & apple pie.

p.s. America still is a place you can buy guns & grow bud
* stands w/ hand on heart. *

[Cihan]

Wisdo: Battlestar Galactica is the best sci-fi show on TV, period. The best sci-fi is not about the future but about today and BSG is so relevent and topical, its essential viewing. Did you see that atmospheric jump manoeuvre in the recent episode 4!? Coolest moment on TV.

But I'm going off topic... I find that Lost is the most addictive show on TV, and I dont think you'll find better praise for a show thats attempting to be a mystery, because all mysteries want you to keep returning, so its doing its job well. Not to beat the dead donkey, but we're not meant to have all the answers at any point in a good mystery, its meant to be continually question after question, with just a few answers now and then to keep us interested and loyal to the story. I am so glad there's a lack of exposition on this show, because clunky exposition, usually in the form of dialogue, usually signals the death of a show or film to me. The Dharma videos have been a great tool to give exposition in a non-clunky way.

Regarding the new characters, I feel like everyone already knows who they are, because I avoid spoilers so I wasnt aware of a cut scene or that they are Brazilian (connection to the Brazilians at the end of last season?) so from that perspective I can still say it wasnt jarring to me the way they were introduced. The only thing off-putting was how godamn handsome the dude was, like he just stepped off a catwalk or something. At least smear sand over his face or something, was everyone on that plane good looking!?

[Cameron]

Great podcast, and great theorising re the Polar Bear. If it was a set up to help Locke regain his sense of purpose I sure would not want to be whomever sent the Polar Bear off on that mission. I mean that thing is probably going to trot back along the subterranean tunnel to the Hydra station and say:

'Look here Ben, I did it exactly like you said, and that bald nutjob burned me with a hairspray flamethrower! Look at what is left of my whiskers! You dumb !@#@#%. Now it's time for me to rip you a new one, you piece of #*!$.'