Get Ready: LOSTCasts 75

We got another great episode of LOST last night, with the airing of season 5, episode 8, LaFleur. Join us this weekend for another podcast, and get involved by posting your comments here, sending us an email, or calling our automated audio comment voicemail at: 206-984-3516...

Comments

[Jackeduplockedown]

A few thoughts on a few things

1. Dharma\Ben\Losties Timeline

December 19th 1963-65 Ben Linus is Born his Mother dies adn his father and he are taken to the hospital by Horace and Olivia Goodspeed

1974 - Losties show up on the Island and almost inadvertently end the truce between the Hostiles and Dharma. Paul, Amy's Husband is killed.

1975-1977 Roger and Ben Linus arrive on the Island and there is no longer an existing truce with the hostiles as evidenced by the fighting Ben witnesses early on in his classroom where he is taight by Olivia Goodspeed. Also during this time Horace falls for Amy and she become pregnant.

So what happened to Olivia and Horace?

Not sure it matters, but it's a strange thing to ignore considering she is still on the Island and they were presumably married in the early to mid 60's.

2. Egyptian mythology References all over the place

From another site; this sums up my research with a few additions I can't verify but seem pretty cool.

A quick game of Match the Egyptian God with the corresponding Lost character

Ra – Richard Albert
Ra was the almost universally-worshipped king of the gods and all-father of creation. Ra is the most central god of the Egyptian pantheon. He is the only god, apart from Osiris, who is definitely said to be not on the earth. Ra, it is said, is an aging god, still powerful, but too old to deal with his children any longer, so he has gone exclusively to the sky to watch over the world.
Comment: He is definitely an ageing God, just not physically. We see him frequently show up in the show, but does seem as if he watches over but does not interfere however he is still powerful and his authority never challenged, in the present at least. He is definitely not of this earth because of the entire phenomenon associated with him.

Osiris – John Locke
Throughout the height of Egyptian civilization, Osiris was the primary deity. In power, he was second only his father, Ra, and was the leader of the gods on earth. Osiris resided in the underworld as the lord of the dead, as after being killed by Set.
Comment: He definitely does listen and follow Richard and does do what he says. He now resides in the underworld because he was killed.

Set – Ben
Set was one of ancient Egypt's earliest gods, a god of chaos, confusion, storms, wind, the desert and foreign lands. He was a contender to the throne of Osiris and rival to Horus, but a companion to the sun god Ra. Originally worshiped and seen as an ambivalent being, during the Third Intermediate Period the people vilified him and turned him into a god of evil. But Seth is not an evil god: he is the god who committed the immoral and evil act of murdering his brother Osiris, but it was this vile act that allowed Osiris to fulfil his destiny and become the god of the dead. Without Seth, there would not have been life after death.
Comment: He does use Smokey to cause damage; also he does travel to and from the island. He does rival Horus as we have found out, and definitely wants to be leader over Locke, but as we have seen has always been a companion of Richard’s. Does appear as if people now view him as evil. He did kill Locke and fulfilled the destiny of sacrifice and rebirth.

Horus – Horace
The worship of Horus was brought from the outside by neighbouring tribes who invaded and then settled into Egypt. He was their god of war; he was the protector and guide to the pharaoh on earth. He also continual battles with Set.
Comment: Brought outside by Dharma Initiative, elevated as leader to fight the others (war). Battles with Ben but Ben and the others topple him. Also is a guide to John Locke when he shows him where the map is.

Anubis – Jacob
Anubis was the god to protect the dead and bring them to the afterlife. The distinctive black color of Anubis “with the black soil of the Nile valley, symbolizing rebirth."
My Comment: Does seem to control the dead as we have seen with Jack’s dad and advising others.

Ammit- Smokey
Ammit is described as "The Devourer" patron of destruction of the souls of the wicked. Ammit sits beneath the Scales of Justice, waiting for the souls to be judged. If the soul is found to be more wicked than good, Anibus feeds it to Ammit.
Comment:This describes Smokey very well, also beneath the scales beneath the temple where Jacob previously resided.

[riverfr0zen]

sweet man. sweet down-low. need to read it again.

[Justin aka Locke Jnr]

Great episode loved the "buddy out there with the eyeliner" Sawyer refers to Richard Alpert - I think this was close to the bone but hilarious!!

[Mark B]

Posted most of this in the other comments section but moved it here too (with some edits) .....

I really liked this episode. If I have any complaint it is that it went too fast and we didn't see enough of the three years in Dharma.

I wonder if that is all we'll see of the statue, I bet it is, but I hope not. As most people have mentioned it looked like some kind of Egyptian deal. I hope we don't end up in some kind of Stargate deal and please no aliens.

I wonder what happened to Olivia who used to hang out with Horace.... She never got a mention. Did she die ? Get killed ? Skip out on Horace with someone ? Decide that Dharma wasn't worth it after all ? Get captured by the Hostiles ? Get given to the Hostiles as part of the truce ?(Perhaps it's as simple as the actress was busy and couldn't get to Hawaii).

I thought Amy (Horaces wife) was going to have a daughter and it was going to be Charlotte. Now I think his son turns out to be Jacob.

Liked being in Dharma times. It was all very 'hippie' ish.

Sawyer seems happy with Juliet and never seemed that happy with Kate. I know the situation is different but he does seem happy.

Wonder where Rose and Bernard are ? Are they in Dharma somewhere ? Surely not or we'd have seen them. Living rough on the island ? Doubt it. With the Hostiles ?

So if the Hostiles can walk through the sonic-boom fence why don't they ? Or is it just Richard who can wander about at will ?

I like the whole truce thing but not sure about the apparent need to be burying the bodies. I mean what is Alpert going to think when two of his men just disappear ? Smokey got them I suppose ? Why not just take the bodies with them back to the Barraks and bury/hide them there ? Why does Alpert need Pauls body ? An eye for an eye deal ?

I thought the fact Juliet shot that one Hostile was a nice shout to the episode when Kate and Sawyer were building the runway and they tried to escape and someone said something about the blonde would have shot you without thinking about it.

Liked Sawyer taking charge and making a deal with Alpert. The whole interaction was, as John says, "interesting". Alpert apparently in total control but being completely shocked by Sawyers knowledge of Jughead etc.

The whole time travel thing and affecting the past seems to have been switched as now they are in the past changing all sorts of things (killing the Hostiles, interacting with Dharma etc.) so does that change the future ? Or is it as Daniel said "What happened happened" is this what always happened ? Will the Losties end up dying in the purge ? Will they crash again in 2004 stuck in some kind of spin cycle ?

All but Jin were on Bea's list. Is this what the list was about ? The people who were in the 1970's are the important ones.

Wonder what is going to happen now with Jack et al turning up. How will they be assimilated into Dharma ? It's not like they can pretend to be the crew that have been lost for the last three years. Will they pretend to be another crash ?

I think Sawyer will be in big trouble with Juliet for not mentioning why he was running out. All that fore-shadowing of the getting over someone just for him apparently not to have gotten over Kate. I'm no shipper but please don't go back to Kate let her go.

So how are they all going to get back to real time ? Assume Widmore hasn't already turned the wheel so perhaps that's what happens.....they have at least one more jump left.

[JonInMinneapolis]

I get duped as much as the next Lostie with red herrings and differentiating between significant foreshadowing/clues and aesthetic choices by the writers...but did anyone else feel the doom and gloom when Daniel says 'the record is skipping again, only we aren't on the track we want to be on', or something like that. It felt like a real clue to me about the nature of the 'timestreams' that they had been just traveling through.

Also, showing Charlotte immediately after that seemed to me to be an effective distraction from what he just said.

If the 'record' had stopped spinning, aka no nosebleeds, no flashes, why would he say that it's spinning again? 3 years later Juliet mentions again that they are not looking forward to anymore time flashes.

This, coupled with the idea that they are apparently changing events without consequence, (although it's likely too that all of this truly had already happened and they are just along for the ride), leads me to believe that we are going to find out that they aren't only skipping in time, but also into alternate realities. The only real evidence of this is that the two concepts go together like Hugo and Dharma Mayo when it comes to time travel writing. Check out: http://tinyurl.com/dem7vb ...especially the 'Time travel and alternate history' section.

Possibly Daniel is worried that they are in a 'static' reality where they will not be able to access their mission, essentially stuck.

How they are then able to meet up with Jack, Hugo, and company at the end defies that whole theory...but Daniel is the resident expert on how the time travel works and I don't think he's telling us everything he knows.

One last thought, the addition of the stunning Reiko Aylesworth, (Amy, Michelle Dessler from 24), and my favorite creepy eyebrow guy Patrick Fischler, (Phil, the guy from the diner who is scared of the bum behind a dumpster in Mulholland Drive), were absolutely stellar choices for the show. I hope they become regulars.

[dominiqueinbrooklyn]

Jon--He says its 'spinning' again, as opposed to 'skipping'...

My biggest question is WHO IS THAT BABY???

Also--If the war that's coming is the Dharma/Hostiles--Widmore told John that if he is not there the wrong side will win--so when the Losties crash, it seems that the others had won--so if that's the "wrong side" and history is being rewritten--is Widmore on Dharma's side??

Oy. I think I'm going to get a nosebleed!!

[JonInMinneapolis]

Ah, that makes much more sense. Still, the multiverse idea, and the idea of 'sideways' traveling through similar realities fit the record metaphor. But so does time-travel by itself.

[Mark B]

Couple of other things .....

1. Rosie says "Guys guys" when she sees Horace on the tv === Nikki with Patchy

2. Is the chair over which Sawyer has tossed his Dharma jumpsuit Jacobs chair ? We got a long shot after he's moved the jumpsuit then we see the chair again later when he gets home with the flower .... probably not just an idea.

[Chris]

I think that Alpert is the statue. It makes the most sense to me at least.

Chew on this thought. We are lead to believe Locke will be the leader of the others. What if he isn't replacing Ben. What if he is replacing Alpert. What if dieing and coming back to life means he has defeated death and is now timeless.

I want to know who the baby is as well. It's ~30 male no distinct ethnicity. To me that leaves Dan? We know the parents of about everyone else that fits that bill.

Ben should be on the island at that point and be about the age where alpert is talking to him.

2 weeks? 2 weeks? whats on next week that kicks off lost?

[Gavin]

Lost.....Well you are now....

How can jack etc re crash on the island in a time before they even new hat the island is or where it is?

They don't yet know about the island because they have never been there yet or mer the people the just crashed with! So they wouldn't know them yet....

~I think we already need one of those catch up episodes!!

[Chris]

@Gavin

your post was a bit hard to understand, not that i am one to talk.

"How can jack etc re crash on the island in a time before they even new hat the island is or where it is?"

How does an island move in time and space in general? we don't know. it involves some energy unique to the island.

jack and them went back in time instead of just crashing because all the original losties were supposed to to fulfill fates plan and that involves them getting time shifted back just like the ones who stayed on the island.

Locke didn't shift probably because he turned and or adjusted the wheel like Ben. Fank didn't because i guess he isn't truly included in the group? Sun? no clue about sun she might have gotten excluded because she is in league with widmore now?

To me it seems you are thinking of this as if 1970s jack is now on 1970s island. If that is how you see it that's not true. 2007-8 jack is now on 1970s island. They have already been there. they know the island. they found out that the are in the past.

don't know if that helps any.

[max cussons]

i think the statue at the beginning bears n uncanny resemblace to the statue of Jebediah Springfield in the simsons!

[Chris]

@ max cussons

There was something about the clothing that did look pioneer ish. my thought was lewis and clark but i like your visual better.

[Mr. LaShade]

So just an interesting thought - no actual evidence to back this up - but wouldn't it be ironic of Juliet gets pregnant and becomes the FIRST woman to die while giving birth. Morbid thought I know, but somehow it makes sense. Since Desmond got off the island, I believe Juliet (of our Losties, even though she is really like a step-lostie) has now been on the island longer than anyone else. She might as well just give up trying to go back home!

Great episode - it wasn't too full and overdone like the previous few! Stay lost!

[lostatheart]

Did the network feed freeze? or is the record still skipping? We did not see the first 28 minutes (is this is new "bad" number? The station scrolled that it would repeat at 12:06am but only the first 28 minutes played.

Where did Charlotte's body go? Daniel said that she moved but they stayed. Was it so she would not see herself as a child?

Sawyer is much happier with Juliet. Kate can not be happy regardless so she messes with Jack and Sawyer.

If the statue is Alpert does that mean that he only has four toes??

[Rok]

The association was alluded to before, but let's draw a direct connection with the writer's throwing a "wink and nod" in here. Ra, Egyptian sun god. Richard Alpert. Richard's initials = RA.

P.S. Anyone run any anagram programs on the full name Richard Alpert? Alpert is such an odd last name, I wonder if the writers left a clue in there, too.

[DMAN]

I like all of the Egyptian references/theories. It kind of make sense given the picture of the spinx that Hurely was painting in the last episode. Why would they pick the spinx if it didn't mean anything?? Anyway, I just watched LaFleur again and paused the episode when the statue came one the screen. If you look closely, the statue seems to be holding two objects in each hand. The object on the right side of the screen sort of looks like the necklace that Paul(Amy's husband)had when they gave up his body to Richard Alpert. Hmmm. What could the necklace signify??

[Mark B]

@Rok

There was a real person called Richard Alpert. He was a lecturer at a US university that did reasearch using LSD I think. He changed his name to Ram Dass.

Here is his wikipedia link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ram_Dass

[Mark B]

@DMAN

The Ankh is a commom Egyptian symbol meaning eternal life.

More from wikipedia ....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ankh

[Mark B]

@Rok
Richard Alpert was a real person who taught at Harvard but got throen out for running experiments with LSD
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Alpert

@DMAN
The Ankh is a common Eygyptian hieroglyphic meaning eternal life ......
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ankh

[Tahir]

I loved seing the 4 toed statue in full but what time were they in ?
Did they flashback 1000's of years at that point ?
Maybe wronly, I thought that statue was very very ancient.

[Lucidlife]

Wow, I had no idea that Ram Dass was once Richard Alpert, ty for that!

[lburf]

@ Tahir
The statue is most likely very ancient, but is obviously still standing in the Dharma era (70's). At some point between then and our Lostie's time on the island the statue gets destroyed.
That is how i see it anyway.

[Tahir]

Just seen some of the online pictures of THAT statue.
Here's a crazy theory.Its a woman.

[Michael]

Read a few theories about what the statue could be. Best I saw was the Egyptian god Taweret carrying two ankhs (the symbole from the necklace in the episode). From Wiki:

"Taweret became seen, very early in Egyptian history, as a deity of protection in pregnancy and childbirth. Pregnant women wore amulets with her name or likeness to protect their pregnancies. Her image could also be found on knives made from hippopotamus ivory, which would be used as wands in rituals to drive evil spirits away from mothers and children.

In most subsequent depictions, Taweret was depicted with features of a pregnant woman. In a composite addition to the animal-compound she was also seen with pendulous breasts, a full pregnant abdomen, and long, straight human hair on her head.

As a protector, she often was shown with one arm resting on the sa symbol, which symbolized protection, and on occasion she carried an ankh, the symbol of life, or a knife, which would be used to threaten evil spirits."

Also had to do a double take at the top of the wiki article when I read "see International Polar Year" as "see International Polar Bear" after seeing our wide travelling polar bears on the show! What do you think?

[JohnnyBeGood]

That just blew me away...we only saw the statue from the back...what if the front of it shows it's pregnant????

Amy had Paul's ankh when she delivered...

[haydn leslie]

kids, the four toed crazy statue was not standing in the dharma era, i have no idea why you think that. The statue was standing BEFORE the FINAL flash, which took them to the dharma 70's era. and im pretty sure its a woman, unless the dude that represents it is proper feminine! haha

And i am SO SO SO confused as to where rose and the other losties are, including the very FEW extra's (survivors we dont know). we know that sawyer told them to go to the creek or something, and young charles widmore said that his men have probably already got them, as he shouted "go to the creek we will meet you there"
so they are either dead :( or!! they are you just chilling by the rocks :)

[Gizzm]

I think Richard Alpert might have to do something with 1960's LSD Icon Timothy Leary.

Check out the Moody Blues Song "Lengend of a Mind" (about Leary)

He'll fly his astral plane
Takes you trips around the bay
Brings you back the same day

as well as:

He'll take you up,
He'll bring you down.
He'll plant your feet back firmly on the ground.
He flies so high,
He swoops so low.
He knows exactly which way he's gonna go.

[Mark B]

Leary and the real Alpert, who became Ram Dass, worked together on the LSD project at Harvard.

[Christian]

Still unaccounted for: Sayid. Haven't seen him with Jack and the gang in the past; no mention of him by Locke or the new folks. Maybe he was actually a proxy for Charlie's stash, and he's still trapped in the airplane crapper. Just throwing it out there. Also, what's up with the Others? In the 50's they're all young, clean cut kids, and they defer to Richard's authority. Now, in the 70's, the Others are sporting more of a biker look, and now Richard has to answer to his people (providing Paul as an "eye for an eye" justice). Widemore is probably in power at this point: is this evidence that he is lacking as a leader, and part of the reason Richard/the Island want him exiled?